Slay the Pagans????

[rhionnach]

According to what has been said on a forum I'm on another reason for the PF deciding to cancel the conference is because of a radio broadcast on Radio 4 on Sunday morning when they broadcast an excert from the Koran that urges:

"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them"

As the area has a high Muslim population this made the PF feel unsafe and so added to the risk.

What a pile of poo.

Comments

[wibbble]

Wow, not only absurd, but highly offensive, too.

I take it that the PF will no longer be participating in interfaith groups that involve Muslims, then, in case they get 'slayed'?

[rhionnach.livejournal.com]

Or perhaps it's an opening for Muslim TV to put on "Khalid, the Pagan Slayer"?

I think in this context the Koran

[forest-wraith.livejournal.com]

is referring to any non-muslim as a Pagan. I'm not sure. Why would the Muslims be scared by this? It should be the Pagans?
Yep, pile of poo, good call.

Re: I think in this context the Koran

[wibbble]

I think they meant that the high Muslim population in the area around the conference venue was scaring the Pagans wanting to attend.

I think that your interpretation is the right one - it looks like the translators were using the Christian usage of the term (ie, someone that's not us).

[brewhexe.livejournal.com]

I wonder why nobody has thought that if enough speakers pull out, they had no choice at this stage to cancel. I run a tiny gathering that takes up half my time just to keep going. Imagine how they felt when they had to cancel, especially after all the shit CoA have put them through.
PF isn't the bees knees in my eyes, but I am assuming that the scottish contingent wouldn't have been going to London anyway, as you get your own. So what are you concerned about?
j xxx

[rhionnach.livejournal.com]

Aren't Scottish people allowed to attend events outside Scotland? That's how your comment sounds.

I was at the London one last year and we had thought about going to it this year. I wasn't at the Scottish one this year and I'm unlikely ever to attend any of them ever again if the present incumbents are still in control so the London one seemed attractive. I used to live in East London, know the area very well, and would quite liked to have attended.

[brewhexe.livejournal.com]

Seeing as York gets very little of anything, thats not what I meant at all. I just don't understand why everyone (and it isn't just you) are assuming that the leaders of PF cancelled due to them being scared when several members of the committee have posted on various forums to explain that they had no choice, as too many speakers, workshops and stalls pulled out. Maybe if the London pagan crowd rally round and help out, something may be rearranged. Just a shame that everyone assumes the PF is the only one at fault here.
j xxx

[tanngrisnir.livejournal.com]

I just don't understand why everyone (and it isn't just you) are assuming that the leaders of PF cancelled due to them being scared...

The reason for that is simple. It's what their announcement said:

Because of concerns about public safety, on-going disruption to public transport and the subsequent withdrawal of some speakers, the PF Committee has agreed with the conference organisers to cancel this event.

If they didn't mean that they were concerned about safety & transport in addition to the fact that speakers withdrew for the same reasons, then the PF really needs to get someone who knows what they are doing to draft their public statements.

And, as I've said elsewhere, there was the option of actually telling everyone that speakers had pulled out, appealing for replacements (frankly, I think those speakers and stalls who were too feart to go to the convention should be named).

Just a shame that everyone assumes the PF is the only one at fault here.

If the PF makes an announcement like that, it is at fault. Any group which says (whether that's what they meant to say or not) that they are cancelling an event in two months because of the bombings in London almost two weeks ago deserves to be castigated. If the statement is true, they deserve it for being cowardly, if it is not true, they deserve it for being so incompetent that they look cowardly.

[brewhexe.livejournal.com]

I think those speakers and stalls who were too feart to go to the convention should be named).
I agree with that. An organisation like PF doesn't just run on money, they run on reputation too. If the conference was cancelled due to people pulling out then PF has every right to name the cancellers so future conventions, moots and fests can make up their minds whether they would be willing to risk inviting them.
I agree that the statement was badly worded, and one of the northern committee members has admitted as much. But the post on the forum about the Radio 4 statement was quoting a rumour, and to castigate PF for something they didn't say, but was attributed to them by someone random is ridiculous.
j xxx

[tanngrisnir.livejournal.com]

I don't see why you should assume we wouldn't go to the London convention. We did last year. We thought about it this year. We probably wouldn't have gone, but not because it was in London: the fact is, the shift of the date to September made it more awkward, and there's also the little fact that the lineup of speakers (with maybe one exception) was pretty crap. From some comments I've heard on the advertised list of speakers, a lot of people round here wouldn't have gone to it had it been local.

On the other hand, if someone had raised the prospect of the thing being cancelled because some wee fearties couldn't face going to Mile End two and a half months after the bomb attacks in Central London, I would have been more inclined to go, if we could have arranged it.

Perhaps it's because I used to live in London that I feel so strongly; but I notice some others feel just as strongly who don't, so maybe not.

Totally out of the loop here

[angelkitty101.livejournal.com]

Which conference have they cancelled? I've not heard anything (mainly cos I'm staying off most Pagan forums as they make me angry), so am currently feeling like 'Confused of Birmingham'.

As a totally random aside, are the forbidden months past? Where is the proof for this?

Re: Totally out of the loop here

[rhionnach.livejournal.com]

It was the The Pagan Federation International Conference 2005.

See here: http://www.paganfed.org/conference2005.htm

As for the forbidden months, I haven't a clue what they are.

Re: Totally out of the loop here

[tanngrisnir.livejournal.com]

The London one, which should have taken place on September 24th.

[kazsorrel.livejournal.com]

Apparently the decision to cancel was taken the Saturday before the radio show.

Some time ago my best friend was Muslim, he explained that for them Muslim was best, then the other Abrahamic religions. Anyone not following one of those religions was considered less than human and didn't matter, thats the pagan reference. For them anyone not following the 3 religions is a pagan.

Doesn't the bible have negative comments in it as well about pagans/witches?

London pagans (including myself) offered to continue the convention and work to get new speakers etc in. There will now be an alternative event which I am waiting to get the details on.

Generally London Pagans seem to feel let-down and abandoned by the PF.